Helmut, list

Yes, Popper’s rejection of idealism - as in Plato’s ‘ideal primal state of Forms’ and Hegel’s ideal final state is expressed in numerous places - and clearly in that quote from 6.348.  And - his rejection of Marxist determinism and necessity - in favour of the realities of chance [ Firstness] and the creativity of Thirdness, or the self-generation of new habits.

Yes, Popper was well aware of Peirce. In his book Objective Knowledge,[Oxford UP, 1972]  Popper references Peirce quite frequently, and called him “one of the greatest philosophers of all time] [212]. And says that his own “indeterminist view of the world” [296] .. is similar to that of Charles Sanders Peirce [ ibid]. 

In fact, Popper’s Three World Theory. [outlined in Objective Knowledge]  has strong relations to Peirces’ Three Modes.  His World 1 is the basic physical world; his World 2 is the world of individual subjective experience; his world 3 is the world of common objective thought.   I consider that Peirce’s modes are superior to this outline - but-…obviously- the similarities are there.

Edwina

On Jan 29, 2024, at 10:03 AM, Helmut Raulien <H.Raulien@gmx.de> wrote:

 
Edwina, John, List,
 
I have read the two books by Karl Popper: "The open society and its enemies" (Thank you for recommending me!), and, as far as I am competent, completely agree with Popper. He is against "historicism", and both refutes Platon (ideal primal state), and Hegel (ideal final state). About Marx, he approves his analysis of the situation at Marx´ time, but refutes his prophecies, and therefore his claim, that there "scienttific"ly is a necessity in history. History is just stories. I wonder, whether Popper knew Peirce, because I see some parallelity.
 
Best, Helmut
 
Gesendet: Sonntag, 28. Januar 2024 um 21:33 Uhr
Von: "Edwina Taborsky" <taborsky@primus.ca>
An: sowa@bestweb.net
Cc: "Peirce List" <peirce-l@list.iupui.edu>, "CG" <cg@lists.iccs-conference.org>
Betreff: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Concluding section 7 of the article on phaneroscopy
John, list
 
Thanks for the chapter.  I particularly liked your inclusion off the Peircean quote;
 

Get rid, thoughtful Reader, of the Okhamistic prejudice of political partisanship that in thought, in being, and in development the indefinite is due to a degeneration from a primal state of perfect definiteness. The truth is rather on the side of the Scholastic realists that the unsettled is the primal state, and that definiteness and determinateness, the two poles of settledness, are, in the large, approximations, developmentally, epistemologically, and metaphysically. (CP 6.348)


This clarifies that neither the primal state nor the ‘final state’ [ of there be such a state] is ‘perfect definiteness’.  Instead, both are unsettled’. How could it be otherwise? Without such indefiniteness, no adaptation or evolution could occur, and the laws of physics would lead to inevitable dissipation of energy/matter. To prevent this- and thus enable ever more complex forms, ‘indefiniteness’  on both sides, is the answer.
 
Edwina.

 
On Jan 27, 2024, at 11:27 PM, John F Sowa <sowa@bestweb.net> wrote:
 
 
 
I finally finished the article on phaneroscopy and sent it off to the publisher.  The final Section 7 is attached.  It shows that Peirce's writings in the last decade of his life are at the forefront of ongoing research in the cognitive sciences (philosophy, psychology, linguistics, artificial intelligence, neuroscience, and anthropology).
 
At the end, I include links to a few other articles that go into more detail about current issues and the importance of Peirce's insights.
 
John 
<Section7.pdf>_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
ARISBE: THE PEIRCE GATEWAY is now at
https://cspeirce.com  and, just as well, at
https://www.cspeirce.com .  It'll take a while to repair / update all the links!
► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply All" to REPLY ON PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to peirce-L@list.iupui.edu .
► To UNSUBSCRIBE, send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to list@list.iupui.edu with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of the message and nothing in the body.  More at https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html .
► PEIRCE-L is owned by THE PEIRCE GROUP;  moderated by Gary Richmond;  and co-managed by him and Ben Udell.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ARISBE: THE PEIRCE GATEWAY is now at https://cspeirce.com and, just as well, at https://www.cspeirce.com . It'll take a while to repair / update all the links! ► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply All" to REPLY ON PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to peirce-L@list.iupui.edu . ► To UNSUBSCRIBE, send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to list@list.iupui.edu with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of the message and nothing in the body. More at https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html . ► PEIRCE-L is owned by THE PEIRCE GROUP; moderated by Gary Richmond; and co-managed by him and Ben Udell.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
ARISBE: THE PEIRCE GATEWAY is now at
https://cspeirce.com  and, just as well, at
https://www.cspeirce.com .  It'll take a while to repair / update all the links!
► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply All" to REPLY ON PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to peirce-L@list.iupui.edu .
► To UNSUBSCRIBE, send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to list@list.iupui.edu with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of the message and nothing in the body.  More at https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html .
► PEIRCE-L is owned by THE PEIRCE GROUP;  moderated by Gary Richmond;  and co-managed by him and Ben Udell.